Clarification on flying?

[PoorMoney]

So, is it illegal to fly my drone in town? I've seen videos where people are flying their drones in their town during the day and night. I would love to get a night shot of my town. The only restricted airspace is the local jail. I was debating about flying it up and circle view the town when everyone starts shooting fireworks, but I guess I am going to my farm.

 

[Ansia]

So, is it illegal to fly my drone in town? I've seen videos where people are flying their drones in their town during the day and night. I would love to get a night shot of my town. The only restricted airspace is the local jail. I was debating about flying it up and circle view the town when everyone starts shooting fireworks, but I guess I am going to my farm.

You should familiarize yourself with your local regulations. Flying at night without special authorization is one. Another is flying over people or moving vehicles, for examples.

 

[DanielC]

Generally, all other things observed, a hobbyist can fly at night with a 3 mile strobe in class g airspace. If you don’t already have the AirMap app you should get it. Free. AirMap have a list of observable items that will help you understand what you can’t do. YouTube is your friend, but make sure the video you reference is current. Flight rules change.

 

[PoorMoney]

Drone Laws in Georgia, U.S. (2022) - UAV Coach

A list of federal, state, and local drone regulations and resources for people flying drones in Georgia, United States.

uavcoach.com

The FAA flightbmap says I am good. I don't have a strobe..only the EVO LEDs. Looks like I need to buy a strobe light then. What is a good one?

 

[DanielC]

Firehouse Technology

motorcycle speakers

www.firehousetechnology.com

I got mine here, but lumecube and others make them.

 

[Crusader]

Drone Laws in Georgia, U.S. (2022) - UAV Coach

A list of federal, state, and local drone regulations and resources for people flying drones in Georgia, United States.

uavcoach.com

The FAA flightbmap says I am good. I don't have a strobe..only the EVO LEDs. Looks like I need to buy a strobe light then. What is a good one?

Where you need to look is 14 CFR Part 107. Subpart D covers waivers, although I'm not sure of the process of getting one. Your best bet, to be sure, is to contact you local Flight Standards District Office aka The FSDO (Fiz-doh) and ask them. You may not be able to get one without the 107 Cert. Your local FSDO is located in Atlanta.

As for the Cert expiring, I'm assuming that it's like all other pilot certs in that the permanent cert wont expire, but you won't be able to "exercise the privileges of" the cert unless you pass a recurrent knowledge test outlined in 107.73(b). The applicable FAR is 107.65.

Before you call the FSDO, read all of Part 107. It's one of the short ones and if you have any questions, I'll check back in and see if I can help. I'm in these regs a lot and have a pretty good handle on them.

Lastly, I just got this one today. Mainly because I can't see my drone for **** against clear blue skies, but also because I'm probably going to request a waiver for certain night time ops as well. The applicable FAR here is 107.29. A strobe only buys you an extra 30 minutes of legal flight without the waiver.

That 30 minutes of Civil Twilight can be calculated by entering you Lat/Long here.

Let us know how it goes.?

 

[DanielC]

Commercial flights require a daytime waiver under part 107. So if you are flying in the furtherance of a business then a waiver is needed. A hobbyist is not a commercial pilot so the waiver is not part of the equation, but the hobbyist can only fly at night in class g airspace with a strobe. All other rules of flight also apply.
That being said - the rules are out there. I’ll try to find the reference for my conjecture. Cheers and happy new year.

 

[Crusader]

Commercial flights require a daytime waiver under part 107. So if you are flying in the furtherance of a business then a waiver is needed. A hobbyist is not a commercial pilot so the waiver is not part of the equation, but the hobbyist can only fly at night in class g airspace with a strobe. All other rules of flight also apply.
That being said - the rules are out there. I’ll try to find the reference for my conjecture. Cheers and happy new year.

Sounds like you've read something somewhere and I hope you can find it, but from what I'm familiar with... I think a strobe alone isn't going to be adequate. For AMA night flight, it looks like you need the appropriate position lights. Red lights on the left, green on the right, white in the rear, but not necessarily a strobe in addition to those standard position lights. I attached the AMA Safety Handbook which contains this vague little nugget, "Night flying requires a lighting system that provides the pilot with a clear view of the model’s attitude and orientation at all times." Why they didn't just say "standard aeronautical position lighting," is beyond me... But that's what it seems to imply. Whether their handbook will carry the weight of law remains to be seen, but I'm sure Govt lawyers will be aware that language exists...

AMA safety code has a part that says the operator won't fly the RC Aircraft in a "careless or reckless manner." Unfortunately, that has a pretty specific meaning to the FAA. They use that language a lot to put the screws to manned pilots. For instance, if I'm out flying VFR in the helicopter and I didn't check NOTAMs and my planned airport is closed, so now I have to divert and end up declaring a low fuel emergency, they can go back and look at my flight planning, see that the NOTAM was published and hit me with operating in a careless or reckless manner. And it is. They'll hit me with 91.13 ON TOP of a 91.103 violation and whatever other rules they decide I broke lol... It's a catch-all phrase they like to hit pilots with when they pursue an enforcement action. 91.13 has the same language as the AMA Safety Guidelines, which is probably not by accident. My guess is that it's there as a contingency in case they want to go after a modeller for some reason, in which case now they have a well established legal framework to start with.

In any event, you could probably get away with a just a strobe for maintaining the appearance of attempting to comply with the law, but I can almost guarantee it won't save your skin if, for some reason, in the event of an incident or accident, they were out for blood. 14 CFR 101.41(b) is how they'd do it and you could like expect to get hit with a 101.43 violation as well.

Honestly, the Evo's LEDs surprised me. Why they aren't standard position lights is baffling. They could have made them standard which would really have helped out in this situation.

Most likely, PoorMoney could get away with flying with a strobe at night under Part 101 and never be questioned, but I wouldn't risk it. Better just to get the 107 cert and comply with those clearly defined rules from a CYA standpoint, imo. Unless you can find something that clearly upends what I tried to cite, better stick with the FARs. As for local rules, I'm not familiar with local laws superceding Federal regs. Seems like a Supremacy Clause issue to me. Are there any you can think of?

Happy New Year to you, too. My resolution is to make some money with my drone! ?

-Crusader

 

[DanielC]

Well said.

There is also an FAA requirement to register drones weighing between .55 grams and 55 lbs. The FAA is also working on an exam for hobbyists that will be rolled out later when it is complete. That qualification will be required to be carried on your person while flying. I don’t have a reference for this but it’s easily found.

Check out:

Drone Law and Drone Attorney Assistance

Aviation Drone Law author, FAA Certified Flight Instructor Pilot & Attorney Jonathan Rupprecht focusing on commercial drone legal and regulation issues .

jrupprechtlaw.com

You searched for Night - Drone Law and Drone Attorney Assistance

jrupprechtlaw.com

Does a model aircraft flyer need a night waiver?
No, only non-recreational operators flying under Part 107 need night waivers. Additionally, government entities can obtain waivers for their departments to fly under.

Future Regulations For Night Flying

In the beginning of January 2019, the FAA published a notice of proposed rule making which allowed for night flying without a waiver. Unfortunately, I don’t think this regulation will become effective till 3-5 years from 2019. I wrote a Forbes article summarizing what was in the lengthy notice of proposed rule making. Basically, the FAA will require those taking the initial and recurrent knowledge exams to learn night flying information. I have created a night operations training course.


DON‘T DO IT BECAUSE I SUGGEST IT IS OKAY.

I won’t be with you if you run into trouble, and it wouldn’t help you if I were. Most authorities are not aware of the rules, and those rules are changing periodically as you can see at the above links and at the FAA Press Release – U.S. Department of Transportation Issues Proposed Rule on Remote ID for Drones

Local authorities are subject to federal rules just like we are and therefore can’t grant permissions either.

Safe flying is everyone’s goal and responsibility. There are federal penalties for breaking FAA rules. Fly safe.

 

[Heckmaniac`s Drone]

Where you need to look is 14 CFR Part 107. Subpart D covers waivers, although I'm not sure of the process of getting one. Your best bet, to be sure, is to contact you local Flight Standards District Office aka The FSDO (Fiz-doh) and ask them. You may not be able to get one without the 107 Cert. Your local FSDO is located in Atlanta.

As for the Cert expiring, I'm assuming that it's like all other pilot certs in that the permanent cert wont expire, but you won't be able to "exercise the privileges of" the cert unless you pass a recurrent knowledge test outlined in 107.73(b). The applicable FAR is 107.65.

Before you call the FSDO, read all of Part 107. It's one of the short ones and if you have any questions, I'll check back in and see if I can help. I'm in these regs a lot and have a pretty good handle on them.

Lastly, I just got this one today. Mainly because I can't see my drone for **** against clear blue skies, but also because I'm probably going to request a waiver for certain night time ops as well. The applicable FAR here is 107.29. A strobe only buys you an extra 30 minutes of legal flight without the waiver.

That 30 minutes of Civil Twilight can be calculated by entering you Lat/Long here.

Let us know how it goes.?

I think only need a waiver if flying under Part 107 - if flying as hobbyist don't need waiver, but still need strobe/anti-collision lighting. I fly at night fairly often.

 

[Heckmaniac`s Drone]

Drone Laws in Georgia, U.S. (2022) - UAV Coach

A list of federal, state, and local drone regulations and resources for people flying drones in Georgia, United States.

uavcoach.com

The FAA flightbmap says I am good. I don't have a strobe..only the EVO LEDs. Looks like I need to buy a strobe light then. What is a good one?

I bought 3 Strobon Cree strobe lights (green, red, white). I use 3m fasteners (5 lb) on the 2 front arms one for green other for red, and the white I attach to the bottom rear as shown in pics. I can validate that I can see there's 3miles away at night.

 

[Ansia]

I think only need a waiver if flying under Part 107 - if flying as hobbyist don't need waiver, but still need strobe/anti-collision lighting. I fly at night fairly often.

I actually asked my local FSDO about this and they replied with "Hobbyist cannot fly at night after the Oct 5, 2018 rules came into effect."

If you do it all the time and haven't gotten in trouble, good. Just know that when you do get caught, ignorance will not save you from the fine.

 

[Crusader]

Well said.

There is also an FAA requirement to register drones weighing between .55 grams and 55 lbs. The FAA is also working on an exam for hobbyists that will be rolled out later when it is complete. That qualification will be required to be carried on your person while flying. I don’t have a reference for this but it’s easily found.

Check out:

Drone Law and Drone Attorney Assistance

Aviation Drone Law author, FAA Certified Flight Instructor Pilot & Attorney Jonathan Rupprecht focusing on commercial drone legal and regulation issues .

jrupprechtlaw.com

You searched for Night - Drone Law and Drone Attorney Assistance

jrupprechtlaw.com

Does a model aircraft flyer need a night waiver?
No, only non-recreational operators flying under Part 107 need night waivers. Additionally, government entities can obtain waivers for their departments to fly under.

Future Regulations For Night Flying

In the beginning of January 2019, the FAA published a notice of proposed rule making which allowed for night flying without a waiver. Unfortunately, I don’t think this regulation will become effective till 3-5 years from 2019. I wrote a Forbes article summarizing what was in the lengthy notice of proposed rule making. Basically, the FAA will require those taking the initial and recurrent knowledge exams to learn night flying information. I have created a night operations training course.


DON‘T DO IT BECAUSE I SUGGEST IT IS OKAY.

I won’t be with you if you run into trouble, and it wouldn’t help you if I were. Most authorities are not aware of the rules, and those rules are changing periodically as you can see at the above links and at the FAA Press Release – U.S. Department of Transportation Issues Proposed Rule on Remote ID for Drones

Local authorities are subject to federal rules just like we are and therefore can’t grant permissions either.

Safe flying is everyone’s goal and responsibility. There are federal penalties for breaking FAA rules. Fly safe.

TONS of good info on that guys site. $1000 for him to prepare a night waiver is a little steep, though. I guess it's that attorney-client privilege?. Still, thank you for posting that. I'm going to start following his website - it's a valuable resource.

You gotta be careful when dealing with the FAA. Cover all your bases. Most importantly, besides just being smart and flying safe, KNOW THE REGS!!! There are horror stories of ramp checks where the FAA official asks to "see" the pilot's cert and then takes off with it. Later, the official claims the pilot "surrendered" the cert. What a nightmare!

I mentioned earlier that PoorMoney would likely be fine as long as there were no incidents. If there was one, however... they ALWAYS (almost) blame pilot. Sullenberger laid one down in the Hudson with zero fatalities and they tore into everything he ever did. If they could have crucified him, they would've. Good to keep in mind that he had a team of attorneys working to keep him out of jail and his certs in his pocket. Just imagine - your drone drops from air and lands on someone's melon. After the FAA, and maybe the NTSB, get through skewering you, then comes the tort... And that insurance you bought, well... you had a legal duty to protect the policy. If the FAA or whoever convinces the judge you didn't have the proper lighting, I can see that going bye-bye.

That careless and reckless language is pretty important. It's really hard to defend against because it can cover so many things. I don't like it anymore than any other pilot, but I know how they can get you for things you probably never thought of. I just finished an Aviation Law class at the university. The instructor started out flying Huey's in Vietnam and ended up retiring from flying Big Iron for FedEx. The stories he told were about enough to make me want to quit flying altogether... Almost haha. A good rule of thumb, everything is pilot error.

 

[Crusader]

I actually asked my local FSDO about this and they replied with "Hobbyist cannot fly at night after the Oct 5, 2018 rules came into effect."

If you do it all the time and haven't gotten in trouble, good. Just know that when you do get caught, ignorance will not save you from the fine.

Wow... well, there ya go. Thanks for the update and taking the time to call. FSDOs are usually pretty helpful. It's when they get on an enforcement footing that you have to watch out for the FAA.

That should be a lesson for all of us. If there are any doubts concerning the regs - Call the FSDO. And get it in writing if at all possible.

-Crusader

 

[Heckmaniac`s Drone]

I actually asked my local FSDO about this and they replied with "Hobbyist cannot fly at night after the Oct 5, 2018 rules came into effect."

If you do it all the time and haven't gotten in trouble, good. Just know that when you do get caught, ignorance will not save you from the fine.

Interesting as I've visited a number of sites indicating you can do so legally as a hobbyist. Can you point me to the document that states what you are saying (for hobbyists - not 107 requirements)? I understand you spoke to someone, but I prefer seeing it in writing if it's specified somewhere.

 

[DanielC]

This applies to daylight hours only:


H. R. 302—113
‘‘§44809. Exception for limited recreational operations of unmanned aircraft
‘‘(a) IN GENERAL.—Except as provided in subsection (e), and notwithstanding chapter 447 of title 49, United States Code, a person may operate a small unmanned aircraft without specific certification or operating authority from the Federal Aviation Administration if the operation adheres to all of the following limitations:
‘‘(1) The aircraft is flown strictly for recreational purposes.
‘‘(2) The aircraft is operated in accordance with or within the programming of a community-based organization’s set of safety guidelines that are developed in coordination with the Federal Aviation Administration.
‘‘(3) The aircraft is flown within the visual line of sight of the person operating the aircraft or a visual observer co- located and in direct communication with the operator.
‘‘(4) The aircraft is operated in a manner that does not interfere with and gives way to any manned aircraft.
‘‘(5) In Class B, Class C, or Class D airspace or within the lateral boundaries of the surface area of Class E airspace designated for an airport, the operator obtains prior authoriza- tion from the Administrator or designee before operating and complies with all airspace restrictions and prohibitions.
‘‘(6) In Class G airspace, the aircraft is flown from the surface to not more than 400 feet above ground level and complies with all airspace restrictions and prohibitions.
‘‘(7) The operator has passed an aeronautical knowledge and safety test described in subsection (g) and maintains proof of test passage to be made available to the Administrator or law enforcement upon request.
‘‘(8) The aircraft is registered and marked in accordance with chapter 441 of this title and proof of registration is made available to the Administrator or a designee of the Adminis- trator or law enforcement upon request.


i don’t think a system for number 7 is yet in https://www.congress.gov/115/bills/hr302/BILLS-115hr302enr.pdf

 

[Heckmaniac`s Drone]

This applies to daylight hours only:


H. R. 302—113
‘‘§44809. Exception for limited recreational operations of unmanned aircraft
‘‘(a) IN GENERAL.—Except as provided in subsection (e), and notwithstanding chapter 447 of title 49, United States Code, a person may operate a small unmanned aircraft without specific certification or operating authority from the Federal Aviation Administration if the operation adheres to all of the following limitations:
‘‘(1) The aircraft is flown strictly for recreational purposes.
‘‘(2) The aircraft is operated in accordance with or within the programming of a community-based organization’s set of safety guidelines that are developed in coordination with the Federal Aviation Administration.
‘‘(3) The aircraft is flown within the visual line of sight of the person operating the aircraft or a visual observer co- located and in direct communication with the operator.
‘‘(4) The aircraft is operated in a manner that does not interfere with and gives way to any manned aircraft.
‘‘(5) In Class B, Class C, or Class D airspace or within the lateral boundaries of the surface area of Class E airspace designated for an airport, the operator obtains prior authoriza- tion from the Administrator or designee before operating and complies with all airspace restrictions and prohibitions.
‘‘(6) In Class G airspace, the aircraft is flown from the surface to not more than 400 feet above ground level and complies with all airspace restrictions and prohibitions.
‘‘(7) The operator has passed an aeronautical knowledge and safety test described in subsection (g) and maintains proof of test passage to be made available to the Administrator or law enforcement upon request.
‘‘(8) The aircraft is registered and marked in accordance with chapter 441 of this title and proof of registration is made available to the Administrator or a designee of the Adminis- trator or law enforcement upon request.


i don’t think a system for number 7 is yet in https://www.congress.gov/115/bills/hr302/BILLS-115hr302enr.pdf

Not sure if you were replying to me - if so I don't see where it states anything about night flights or restrictions in conducting them as a hobbiest. If not in ref to my question I apologize.

 

[Jagerbomb52]

With the FAA's rolling roll out of Section 349 of the 2018 FMRA, limited recreational flyers (previously called hobbyists) were first disallowed from flying in controlled airspace (with the exception of approved fixed site designated areas that already had LOAs or COAs). They then opened controlled airspace by expanding LAANC to recreational operators, but only for daylight flights. The FAA has reported that they are working on further expanding LAANC to allow nighttime LAANC approved flights in controlled airspace, but until that happens, hobbyists remain confined to Class G for nighttime flying.

FAA Grounds AMA Event: “No Pathway for Recreational Operators”

The AMA was denied permission to hold their annual night flying event at the AMA Expo West this year – and members are asking why. The Academy of Model Aeronautics – the AMA – held t

dronelife.com

 

[DanielC]

Not sure if you were replying to me - if so I don't see where it states anything about night flights or restrictions in conducting them as a hobbiest. If not in ref to my question I apologize.

This section refer to daylight hours. Sorry I hit send too soon.

 

[Heckmaniac`s Drone]

With the FAA's rolling roll out of Section 349 of the 2018 FMRA, limited recreational flyers (previously called hobbyists) were first disallowed from flying in controlled airspace (with the exception of approved fixed site designated areas that already had LOAs or COAs). They then opened controlled airspace by expanding LAANC to recreational operators, but only for daylight flights. The FAA has reported that they are working on further expanding LAANC to allow nighttime LAANC approved flights in controlled airspace, but until that happens, hobbyists remain confined to Class G for nighttime flying.

FAA Grounds AMA Event: “No Pathway for Recreational Operators”

The AMA was denied permission to hold their annual night flying event at the AMA Expo West this year – and members are asking why. The Academy of Model Aeronautics – the AMA – held t

dronelife.com

So like I've been doing, I can fly as hobbyist in class G at night with proper lighting?