Aircraft Avoidance? I had no idea!

tvwxman · Aug 30, 2020

For those of you familiar with Charlotte, NC I launched my EVO 2 Pro in Romare Bearden park Friday afternoon. I had to get my FAA approval via Kitty Hawk since the airport is close enough to uptown and we're in controlled airspace. While hovering around my max allowable ceiling of 250 feet, out of nowhere a police chopper flies over pretty low and starts circling. I got a little paranoid and thought I better bring it back and land hoping I hadn't caused a problem.

I couldn't. The drone froze and messages popped up on my screen about nearby aircraft. After several attempts and with the chopper taking a wide turn I was able to descend and ease it back to my location. I had not bumped into this feature either via the manual or other information on the internet. Is it out there hiding in plain sight? Either way, it was a nice surprise to see this has it. Oh, and I still haven't upgraded to FW 2.5 yet due to the other concerns swirling around about it right now.

I'm attaching a 4K 60fps @80 - 90 Mbps twilight clip I took of Charlotte. Sadly, I can never fly around the city after 30 minutes past sunset, again, due to the FAA limitations here, but at least this turned out well. The youtube compression is causing some false contouring in the sky, the original video is rock solid.

Eric

AdamJ1555 · Aug 31, 2020

We’re you flying on the Explorer app or were you using AirMap or Kittyhawk for the flight?

pedals2paddles · Aug 31, 2020

It would have to be an onboard ADSB receiver, receiving the ADSB out transponder signal from nearby aircraft that are so equipped. If the Evo 2 has that, that's a fantastic feature, and I don't know why they wouldn't advertise it or tell you about it. I see no mention of it googling, other than some DJI copters that have it. I have this on my arducopter UAS and it is great.

Ansia · Aug 31, 2020

pedals2paddles said:
It would have to be an onboard ADSB receiver, receiving the ADSB out transponder signal from nearby aircraft that are so equipped. If the Evo 2 has that, that's a fantastic feature, and I don't know why they wouldn't advertise it or tell you about it. I see no mention of it googling, other than some DJI copters that have it. I have this on my arducopter UAS and it is great.

It does not have ADS-B. This is the first time I have heard of an Evo indicating as such.

tvwxman · Aug 31, 2020

I can absolutely assure you it was not my imagination! Not only would my drone not return to me attempting a level flight return, but I saw the "Nearby Aircraft" messages popping up on my screen. And to answer the earlier question, yes, I'm using the Autel Explorer App on my Samsung Galaxy S20 Ultra for my flight display/navigation which is where the messages were appearing. I used the Kitty Hawk app to get FAA authorization before lifting off.

As said in my confusion, I finally tried descending which it allowed me then I was able to ease back to my home point manually.

Ansia · Aug 31, 2020

tvwxman said:
I can absolutely assure you it was not my imagination! Not only would my drone not return to me attempting a level flight return, but I saw the "Nearby Aircraft" messages popping up on my screen. And to answer the earlier question, yes, I'm using the Autel Explorer App on my Samsung Galaxy S20 Ultra for my flight display/navigation which is where the messages were appearing. I used the Kitty Hawk app to get FAA authorization before lifting off.

As said in my confusion, I finally tried descending which it allowed me then I was able to ease back to my home point manually.

We are not doubting your experience. We are just puzzled on how you got that message, when there is no ADS-B installed in your drone.

kenautelevo2pro · Aug 31, 2020

tvwxman said:
I can absolutely assure you it was not my imagination! Not only would my drone not return to me attempting a level flight return, but I saw the "Nearby Aircraft" messages popping up on my screen. And to answer the earlier question, yes, I'm using the Autel Explorer App on my Samsung Galaxy S20 Ultra for my flight display/navigation which is where the messages were appearing. I used the Kitty Hawk app to get FAA authorization before lifting off.

As said in my confusion, I finally tried descending which it allowed me then I was able to ease back to my home point manually.

and then also a few of us might be confused by a couple of other things you said, so my bad.

you said:
"nearby aircraft" message popping up on my SCREEN
I'm using the Autel Explorer App on my Samsung Galaxy S20 Ultra for my flight display/navigation which is where the messages were appearing.

question:
are you getting the warnings on a) your samsung, or b) your autel rc?

you said:
I used the kitty hawk app to get faa authorization before lifting off

question:
this is just a process, right? there is no connection with the drone and the kitty hawk app to authorize the drone to fly, right? "before" means prior to but not dependent on, correct?

pedals2paddles · Aug 31, 2020

The only way for any app or device to know this information is with an onboard ADS-B receiver, or an API accessing ADS-B data from a 3rd party service over the internet. I find it hard to believe Autel forgot to mention that the Evo has ADS-B in and collision avoidance. And I would think someone would have noticed it by now even if Autel did neglect to mention it. And I can find no evidence that the Kitty Hawk app has this feature either.

Tufargon · Aug 31, 2020

Sounds like you're talking about the Mavic Air 2.

kenautelevo2pro · Aug 31, 2020

Tufargon said:
Sounds like you're talking about the Mavic Air 2.

sounds like it but still, when I get those warnings on my ma2, doesn't seem to block or prevent me from flying where or how I wish. maybe it's because I take evasive action anyway and in my cases, the warnings come long before the aircraft is visible or audible. the feature is quite spectacular and would be nice if Autel EVO 2 had it.

tvwxman · Sep 1, 2020

Hi all, again, no offense taken for anyone wanting to ask more questions and drill down into my situation. I realize I'm a rather new member here and do not have a long track record of being a credible poster.

I will try to compile the above questions into this post. First and foremost I want to say the "Aircraft Nearby" message definitely appeared in the Autel Explorer app, not anything like a text message notification or something similar you'd expect from the Samsung phone. The only possible exception could be the Kitty Hawk app (which was still running in the background) as it could have possibly splashed that message on my screen? But my sense is, I seem to remember it appearing in those orange boxes which slide out and are specific to the Autel App when it wants you to know something. But I can't be 100% certain now. Secondly, yes, I used the Kitty Hawk app to obtain FAA authorization, but once done, I ignore it from that point forward as all my focus is on the Autel Explorer when actually flying.

Again, this was all unfolding quickly and unexpectedly for me and while my memory might be flawed here with some of the details as my mind went from 0 - 100 in a half second, there's no doubt this actually happened. With that being the case, here's my question back to the experts here:

Since the FAA knew exactly who I was, where I was and when I was flying in a specifically defined airspace, is it not possible when a government aircraft entered my same airspace, that they can intervene (even through AI or some other algorithm) and alert me either through the Autel app or the Kitty Hawk app both of which were still running, and do so without the necessity of an ADS-B receiver???

I don't think it will help much, but when I get home, I will post my flight log.

tvwxman · Sep 1, 2020

Ok so I had to post the video (screen recording) of my flight log on youtube in order for anyone interested to see it. Here's the description:

2:57 - 3:02: This was my first attempt to do another pass on the skyline bringing the drone back in my direction. All was fine at very first until five seconds into it when the drone abruptly stopped. It bucked, almost as if it thought is was running into a wall.

3:21 - 3:24: You can see the joysticks. I gave it a right-command and it bucked again.

3:37 - 3:38: Right-command, bucked and stopped.

3:43 - 3:44: Right-command, bucked and stopped.

4:00 - 4:13: Finally decided to descend from 208 feet to 142 feet at which point I was able to return home and gave up on anymore video recording, just wanting to land at that point.

Eric

pedals2paddles · Sep 1, 2020

tvwxman said:
Since the FAA knew exactly who I was, where I was and when I was flying in a specifically defined airspace, is it not possible when a government aircraft entered my same airspace, that they can intervene (even through AI or some other algorithm) and alert me either through the Autel app or the Kitty Hawk app both of which were still running, and do so without the necessity of an ADS-B receiver???

No, there is no means by which for the FAA to take control of your copter. This is something that would have to be done locally by the copter/controller firmware using an onboard ADSB receiver or receiving ADSB data from a third-party API over the internet. This is not a function that Autel nor Kitty Hawk have ever said anything about. Which is really weird.

AdamJ1555 · Sep 3, 2020

AirMap will notify you of aircraft in th vicinity if you have it connected with your controller and display their approximate location on the map... Autel Explorer will not.

Ansia · Sep 3, 2020

AdamJ1555 said:
AirMap will notify you of aircraft in th vicinity if you have it connected with your controller and display their approximate location on the map... Autel Explorer will not.

Do you mean when you fly your drone with the airmap app or while you have it displayed? I've seen other drones displayed, but never an airplane or helo.

AdamJ1555 · Sep 3, 2020

AirMap has alerted to other “aircraft” in the area with an icon that looked like a Cessna. It may have actually been a drone - I never saw the physical aircraft... but if the app was running in the background it will send a notification similar to what’s being described by the OP.

moodman · Sep 5, 2020

Have you considered that the sensors on the Evo might be able to "know" the difference between a static object and one that is moving in relation to the Evo? I wouldn't be surprised if it gives you the same alert if a bird is nearby.

MSAllen · Sep 5, 2020

Hey Mike, I'm a life long Charlottean and an EVO 1 owner... Congrats on a very long and successful career for us TV viewers. We have a local drone meet up group that flies at the old Knight's Stadium parking lot on Saturday's if you'd ever like to join. I'd like to see the EVO 2 in action!

Ansia · Sep 5, 2020

moodman said:
Have you considered that the sensors on the Evo might be able to "know" the difference between a static object and one that is moving in relation to the Evo? I wouldn't be surprised if it gives you the same alert if a bird is nearby.

They don't know the difference.

tvwxman · Sep 5, 2020

Hi MSAllen, this is Eric, I replaced Mike McKay in 1993 if that's who you were thinking of. Thanks for the heads up on your club, what time do you meet?