Hello all,
Wonder if I am the tonto here so asking for an advise from the forum.
First of all I have been piloting a GoPro Karma drone for almost 5 years and has my licences with UK CAA and EU aviation authority in Denmark so I am no newbee flying drones.
Brought a Evo Lite Plus in end of September and I had a few flights in the UK before I took the UAS with me on holidays to Colombia.
On the 9th of December 2022 I had the pleasure flying the drone with no issues at all but on my fourth flight about 9 minutes into the flight the drone controller came up with aircraft battery is low. Flew for about another minute and returned to the landing take off spot with12 percent of battery left.
I had completed about 10 minutes of flying but the drone refused to approach the landing spot any further than 8 meters away which was just above the ocean with a shore of very sharp rocks of about 75 cms width and 1 meter to the ocean surface. The image below shows where I was controlling the UAS from and as it is clear there is plenty of space where the drone could land without the obstacle avoidance should have prevented the UAS approach is that is what transpired.
Between approximately 10:02 and 10:26 I fought of control with the drone as I wanted to land the drone manually where I was standing i.e 5-6 meters from the drone where it, from time to time, would hover about 5-6 meters above sea level and sometimes it would attempt to ascend to what I presume was the hover setting of 30 meters as if it was to return to home. I would then cancel the return to home and manually force it close to the shore which I almost managed until the mobile screen turned black, and the controller no longer responded to any of the joystick movements and as such there was no longer any control with the aircraft. This is visual on the logs as from 10:28 the app did not record any activity in speed, altitude, or distance.
With just a couple of meters from shore the drone decided to forcefully land (probably as it lost connectivity to the controller) on to the shore of rocks falling off the rocks into sea after the propellers hit the rocks.
I jumped into the water to rescue the drone (not without injuring myself in the process) and now realize there isn’t even any footage from the last flight to demonstrate what transpired.
The outcome is that battery is no longer functional the drone is not detected by the controller even with another fresh battery.
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Agreed to send the aircraft in to Autel EU for inspection once I returned back to the UK where I live.
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This is the reply I got back from Autel Support
Please check the analysis result as blow:
The aircraft works in GPS mode;
The time of flight is 9 minutes and 28 seconds, the relative altitude is 12 meters, the aircraft is 22 meters away from the return point, and the power is 15%. The aircraft triggers the return, and the aircraft triggers the return to rise, but the pilot pulls down the lever to prevent the rise; The flight time is 9 minutes and 51 seconds the relative altitude is 13 meters, and the flight is 20 meters from the return point. The pilot cancels the return;
The flight time is 10 minutes and 11 seconds, the relative height is 5 meters, the distance is 8.7 meters from return point , and the power is 13%. The aircraft triggers the return flight again, and the aircraft starts to rise. During the rising process, the pilot still pullws down the lever to prevent the aircraft from rising;
The flight time is 10 minutes and 34 seconds, the relative height is 9.6 meters, the distance from the return point is 8.7 meters, and the power is12%. When the aircraft is in the return state, fly the hand lever, and the record is closed during the descent of the aircraft;
Return point: 12.482501 - 81.726796; Stop point: 12.482489 - 81.726718.
Conclusion: The customer shouldn't keep the aircraft in the return state and operate the lever to delay the return time, so it is hard to determine this crash caused by product problem, improper operation is more likely to be the cause of this crash.
Since your aircraft fell into water and has no maintenance value, we can only recommend you to buy a new fuselage.
Please check the quotation as attachment, I have tried my best to apply for a 30% discount from the manager. I hope you can accept it
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Obviously I was unhappy with that conclusion so I replied back to Autel Support
Thank you for your email and replacement offer.
Unfortunately, I am not especially pleased with the outcome of your investigation.
As per your investigation the first conclusion is:
The time of flight is 9 minutes and 28 seconds, the relative altitude is 12 meters, the aircraft is 22 meters away from the return point, and the power is 15%.
So far, I am in agreement with the findings.
Now the flight time is 9 minutes and 51 seconds the relative altitude is 13 meters, and the flight is 20 meters from the return point.
Which is when I am flying towards the return point and when the aircraft triggers a return to home (which is silly as the pilot is actually flying towards the return point) and begins to rise when the logic in the controller should detect the pilot is actually flying towards the return point and decreasing the aircrafts altitude to ground level.
That also explains why the pilot tries to prevent the rise by cancelling the RTH.
Think for a moment; What would have happened if the aircraft was over land and the pilot wanted to land exactly when the aircraft alerts of low battery and at the same coordinates where the alert was triggered. Why should the aircraft return to home force the aircraft up and towards the return to home spot if the pilot wants to land at the spot where the alert occurred?
I would like to suggest your RD department employ some AI in the controller.
Next, after 20 seconds of flying it should be obvious to the controller that the pilot is attempting to return to the return spot as at flight time is 10 minutes and 11 seconds, the relative height is 5 meters, the distance is 8.7 meters from return point, and the power is 13%.
That is a decrease in distance of 11.3 meters and decrease in altitude of 8 meters from the return to home point and the controller should have concluded that.
Instead the aircraft does the opposite and raise in altitude following a RTH which I as a pilot try to circumvent trying to prevent the aircraft from rising using the remote controller.
That there is a clear bug in the controller firmware / product failure is super clear from the next of your analysis.
23 seconds later or at 10 minutes and 34 seconds into the flight, the relative height is 9.6 meters, the distance from the return point is 8.7 meters, and the power is12%.
This is where I am frantically trying to pilot the aircraft forward towards the return spot but the aircraft does not move and as you also clearly state the logging stopped abrupt.
“When the aircraft is in the return state, fly the hand lever, and the record is closed during the descent of the aircraft”
As I have explained in the description of the crash the screen connected to the controller went black and the controller stopped responding to commands.
That is also what you saw in the logs because the altitude is 8.7 meters at that point and the aircraft had not even touched the surface at that point and not even moved towards the return spot.
Your conclusion: The customer shouldn't keep the aircraft in the return state and operate the lever to delay the return time, so it is hard to determine this crash caused by product problem, improper operation is more likely to be the cause of this crash.
Yet you state, “it is hard to determine this crash caused by product problem” and then when you can’t determine the cause you blame it on the pilot.
I think I will post to autelpilots.com forum and see what the feedback is in there as I have seen other pilots mentioning they also had experiences with unresponsive controllers. Is this "normal", if not is it worth contacting Autel? | Autel Drone Forum (autelpilots.com)
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Their reply to my email:
Each aircraft own its logic of return. Our aircraft's return logic requires the drone to rise first and then return to return spot. This is maybe different from what you know.
Let's meet each other halfway.
My manager and I spent a long time discussing your case, she can give you a maximum discount of 50% in her authority.
I am attaching the new quotation at 50%.
------------------------------------------------------------------
I am I in the wrong here and should I accept the offer or is Autel in the wrong?
Thanks in advance for taking your time reading this long post.
Michael
Wonder if I am the tonto here so asking for an advise from the forum.
First of all I have been piloting a GoPro Karma drone for almost 5 years and has my licences with UK CAA and EU aviation authority in Denmark so I am no newbee flying drones.
Brought a Evo Lite Plus in end of September and I had a few flights in the UK before I took the UAS with me on holidays to Colombia.
On the 9th of December 2022 I had the pleasure flying the drone with no issues at all but on my fourth flight about 9 minutes into the flight the drone controller came up with aircraft battery is low. Flew for about another minute and returned to the landing take off spot with12 percent of battery left.
I had completed about 10 minutes of flying but the drone refused to approach the landing spot any further than 8 meters away which was just above the ocean with a shore of very sharp rocks of about 75 cms width and 1 meter to the ocean surface. The image below shows where I was controlling the UAS from and as it is clear there is plenty of space where the drone could land without the obstacle avoidance should have prevented the UAS approach is that is what transpired.
Between approximately 10:02 and 10:26 I fought of control with the drone as I wanted to land the drone manually where I was standing i.e 5-6 meters from the drone where it, from time to time, would hover about 5-6 meters above sea level and sometimes it would attempt to ascend to what I presume was the hover setting of 30 meters as if it was to return to home. I would then cancel the return to home and manually force it close to the shore which I almost managed until the mobile screen turned black, and the controller no longer responded to any of the joystick movements and as such there was no longer any control with the aircraft. This is visual on the logs as from 10:28 the app did not record any activity in speed, altitude, or distance.
With just a couple of meters from shore the drone decided to forcefully land (probably as it lost connectivity to the controller) on to the shore of rocks falling off the rocks into sea after the propellers hit the rocks.
I jumped into the water to rescue the drone (not without injuring myself in the process) and now realize there isn’t even any footage from the last flight to demonstrate what transpired.
The outcome is that battery is no longer functional the drone is not detected by the controller even with another fresh battery.
----------------------------------------------------------------
Agreed to send the aircraft in to Autel EU for inspection once I returned back to the UK where I live.
----------------------------------------------------------------
This is the reply I got back from Autel Support
Please check the analysis result as blow:
The aircraft works in GPS mode;
The time of flight is 9 minutes and 28 seconds, the relative altitude is 12 meters, the aircraft is 22 meters away from the return point, and the power is 15%. The aircraft triggers the return, and the aircraft triggers the return to rise, but the pilot pulls down the lever to prevent the rise; The flight time is 9 minutes and 51 seconds the relative altitude is 13 meters, and the flight is 20 meters from the return point. The pilot cancels the return;
The flight time is 10 minutes and 11 seconds, the relative height is 5 meters, the distance is 8.7 meters from return point , and the power is 13%. The aircraft triggers the return flight again, and the aircraft starts to rise. During the rising process, the pilot still pullws down the lever to prevent the aircraft from rising;
The flight time is 10 minutes and 34 seconds, the relative height is 9.6 meters, the distance from the return point is 8.7 meters, and the power is12%. When the aircraft is in the return state, fly the hand lever, and the record is closed during the descent of the aircraft;
Return point: 12.482501 - 81.726796; Stop point: 12.482489 - 81.726718.
Conclusion: The customer shouldn't keep the aircraft in the return state and operate the lever to delay the return time, so it is hard to determine this crash caused by product problem, improper operation is more likely to be the cause of this crash.
Since your aircraft fell into water and has no maintenance value, we can only recommend you to buy a new fuselage.
Please check the quotation as attachment, I have tried my best to apply for a 30% discount from the manager. I hope you can accept it
----------------------------------------------------------
Obviously I was unhappy with that conclusion so I replied back to Autel Support
Thank you for your email and replacement offer.
Unfortunately, I am not especially pleased with the outcome of your investigation.
As per your investigation the first conclusion is:
The time of flight is 9 minutes and 28 seconds, the relative altitude is 12 meters, the aircraft is 22 meters away from the return point, and the power is 15%.
So far, I am in agreement with the findings.
Now the flight time is 9 minutes and 51 seconds the relative altitude is 13 meters, and the flight is 20 meters from the return point.
Which is when I am flying towards the return point and when the aircraft triggers a return to home (which is silly as the pilot is actually flying towards the return point) and begins to rise when the logic in the controller should detect the pilot is actually flying towards the return point and decreasing the aircrafts altitude to ground level.
That also explains why the pilot tries to prevent the rise by cancelling the RTH.
Think for a moment; What would have happened if the aircraft was over land and the pilot wanted to land exactly when the aircraft alerts of low battery and at the same coordinates where the alert was triggered. Why should the aircraft return to home force the aircraft up and towards the return to home spot if the pilot wants to land at the spot where the alert occurred?
I would like to suggest your RD department employ some AI in the controller.
Next, after 20 seconds of flying it should be obvious to the controller that the pilot is attempting to return to the return spot as at flight time is 10 minutes and 11 seconds, the relative height is 5 meters, the distance is 8.7 meters from return point, and the power is 13%.
That is a decrease in distance of 11.3 meters and decrease in altitude of 8 meters from the return to home point and the controller should have concluded that.
Instead the aircraft does the opposite and raise in altitude following a RTH which I as a pilot try to circumvent trying to prevent the aircraft from rising using the remote controller.
That there is a clear bug in the controller firmware / product failure is super clear from the next of your analysis.
23 seconds later or at 10 minutes and 34 seconds into the flight, the relative height is 9.6 meters, the distance from the return point is 8.7 meters, and the power is12%.
This is where I am frantically trying to pilot the aircraft forward towards the return spot but the aircraft does not move and as you also clearly state the logging stopped abrupt.
“When the aircraft is in the return state, fly the hand lever, and the record is closed during the descent of the aircraft”
As I have explained in the description of the crash the screen connected to the controller went black and the controller stopped responding to commands.
That is also what you saw in the logs because the altitude is 8.7 meters at that point and the aircraft had not even touched the surface at that point and not even moved towards the return spot.
Your conclusion: The customer shouldn't keep the aircraft in the return state and operate the lever to delay the return time, so it is hard to determine this crash caused by product problem, improper operation is more likely to be the cause of this crash.
Yet you state, “it is hard to determine this crash caused by product problem” and then when you can’t determine the cause you blame it on the pilot.
I think I will post to autelpilots.com forum and see what the feedback is in there as I have seen other pilots mentioning they also had experiences with unresponsive controllers. Is this "normal", if not is it worth contacting Autel? | Autel Drone Forum (autelpilots.com)
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Their reply to my email:
Each aircraft own its logic of return. Our aircraft's return logic requires the drone to rise first and then return to return spot. This is maybe different from what you know.
Let's meet each other halfway.
My manager and I spent a long time discussing your case, she can give you a maximum discount of 50% in her authority.
I am attaching the new quotation at 50%.
------------------------------------------------------------------
I am I in the wrong here and should I accept the offer or is Autel in the wrong?
Thanks in advance for taking your time reading this long post.
Michael
