Dronetag Beacon Ongoing Observations and Discussions

[GeekOnTheWing]

I figured this device deserved a thread of its own since it's one of the earlier RID modules that meets FAA and EU requirements, and because I have one.

My own contributions will be somewhat rambling as I just got the thing yesterday. I've only flown one short test flight with it mounted, and probably won't be flying any more any time soon because of WX.

Here's a picture of the temporary mounting location I chose (aircraft is an EVO II Pro 6K).



I am considering plans for a better location. I just stuck it there for testing.

Some initial observations:

The Dronetag Beacon appears to require opening an account with the manufacturer and associating the device with a drone before it will work. After that, it did work once (which was the one time I tried it) using only the button on the module itself.

Registration requires only an email address and password, appears to conform to EU privacy laws, and appears to be able to be deleted if the user desires. Associated devices and drones can also be added or deleted as the user desires. Advanced analytics is enabled by default, but opting out is easy.

The basic account is free. There are paid options that don't seem to provide anything of value to me based on a quick glance.

The iOS app doesn't especially suck. It does offer flight planning and claims to provide controlled airspace information, as well as information about other drones that have elected to make their flight data public. I haven't tested those claims and probably won't any time soon because I live in the sticks.

On the other hand, I do resent devices that require me to install apps, mainly for privacy reasons. This one seems more respectful of privacy than most, however (at least on iOS), presumably because of EU law and Apple's policies. It only requested Bluetooth and Notification permissions.

The iOS app also works on iPad (at least on my iPad Pro 11-inch with Cellular). It didn't request location permission, so presumably it only gets that from the RID module. That also means that at most, only the operator's location at takeoff would be transmitted, because the app itself doesn't request location permission.

There also is a Web app. Other than logging into it and verifying that it is in sync with my account, I haven't tested it.

Both the iPad compatibility and the fact that the app doesn't request location permission make the mobile app more tolerable to me because unlike my phone, I don't have my iPad with me and turned on everywhere I go. So even if I decide that I love the app (unlikely, but one never knows), I don't have to carry it with me everywhere. It can be compartmentalized, as it were.

Distances and weights are metric by default but selectable for Imperial if desired. Mission radius and max altitude are also user-selectable. The settings are saved to the account, so they're synced across the various apps. I don't know whether they're also saved to the device itself.

One can plan a flight on the app, and the device will automatically start the flight when telemetry is received. That assumes that one is using the app and has a cell connection on a device that's present at the location. That could be a handy feature for some, although it's not one that I personally need.

That's all that comes to mind off the top of my head. Additional flight testing is unlikely for at least a few days due to weather.

 

[JSTorsrud]

I figured this device deserved a thread of its own since it's one of the earlier RID modules that meets FAA and EU requirements, and because I have one.

My own contributions will be somewhat rambling as I just got the thing yesterday. I've only flown one short test flight with it mounted, and probably won't be flying any more any time soon because of WX.

Here's a picture of the temporary mounting location I chose (aircraft is an EVO II Pro 6K).

View attachment 16150

I am considering plans for a better location. I just stuck it there for testing.

Some initial observations:

The Dronetag Beacon appears to require opening an account with the manufacturer and associating the device with a drone before it will work. After that, it did work once (which was the one time I tried it) using only the button on the module itself.

Registration requires only an email address and password, appears to conform to EU privacy laws, and appears to be able to be deleted if the user desires. Associated devices and drones can also be added or deleted as the user desires. Advanced analytics is enabled by default, but opting out is easy.

The basic account is free. There are paid options that don't seem to provide anything of value to me based on a quick glance.

The iOS app doesn't especially suck. It does offer flight planning and claims to provide controlled airspace information, as well as information about other drones that have elected to make their flight data public. I haven't tested those claims and probably won't any time soon because I live in the sticks.

On the other hand, I do resent devices that require me to install apps, mainly for privacy reasons. This one seems more respectful of privacy than most, however (at least on iOS), presumably because of EU law and Apple's policies. It only requested Bluetooth and Notification permissions.

The iOS app also works on iPad (at least on my iPad Pro 11-inch with Cellular). It didn't request location permission, so presumably it only gets that from the RID module. That also means that at most, only the operator's location at takeoff would be transmitted, because the app itself doesn't request location permission.

There also is a Web app. Other than logging into it and verifying that it is in sync with my account, I haven't tested it.

Both the iPad compatibility and the fact that the app doesn't request location permission make the mobile app more tolerable to me because unlike my phone, I don't have my iPad with me and turned on everywhere I go. So even if I decide that I love the app (unlikely, but one never knows), I don't have to carry it with me everywhere. It can be compartmentalized, as it were.

Distances and weights are metric by default but selectable for Imperial if desired. Mission radius and max altitude are also user-selectable. The settings are saved to the account, so they're synced across the various apps. I don't know whether they're also saved to the device itself.

One can plan a flight on the app, and the device will automatically start the flight when telemetry is received. That assumes that one is using the app and has a cell connection on a device that's present at the location. That could be a handy feature for some, although it's not one that I personally need.

That's all that comes to mind off the top of my head. Additional flight testing is unlikely for at least a few days due to weather.

I'm curious as I have been following Drone ID articles. I'm sure I missed it someplace, but does each drone you own require it's own or separate ID TAG. Or can you use the Same ID Tag on Different Aircraft?

 

[GeekOnTheWing]

I'm curious as I have been following Drone ID articles. I'm sure I missed it someplace, but does each drone you own require it's own or separate ID TAG. Or can you use the Same ID Tag on Different Aircraft?

As far as the company is concerned, the same Dronetag device can be assigned to multiple aircraft. The app provides for it and also allows one drone to be the default if more than one are associated with the Dronetag.

As for FAA, I don't know. I spoke to a fellow at FAADroneZone support who admitted that the registration system is lacking. To add the module to a drone requires that the registration be edited, and the drone's serial number replaced by the module serial number.

Because the drone manufacturer and model are not editable, that creates an inherent conflict. The drone serial number disappears, and the module manufacturer's information doesn't appear anywhere in FAA's registration system unless it's coded into the serial number somehow.

The FAA fellow said that editing the drone registration requirements and modifying the Web site to match them literally requires an Act of Congress; so for now, changing the serial number on the drone to the RID module's serial number is what they're doing.

In short: I don't know what would happen if the same RID module serial number is applied to an additional drone in FAA's system. It may welcome it with open arms and a sloppy kiss, or it may vomit on it. I just don't know. It will not, however, create a problem on the company's system.

It also is possible to register the RID module separately as a UAS and pay the fee, but that would only make sense in very limited recreational situations where the drone itself is not required to be registered, but the operator wants RID.

 

[ne0031]

As far as the company is concerned, the same Dronetag device can be assigned to multiple aircraft. The app provides for it and also allows one drone to be the default if more than one are associated with the Dronetag.

As for FAA, I don't know. I spoke to a fellow at FAADroneZone support who admitted that the registration system is lacking. To add the module to a drone requires that the registration be edited, and the drone's serial number replaced by the module serial number.

Because the drone manufacturer and model are not editable, that creates an inherent conflict. The drone serial number disappears, and the module manufacturer's information doesn't appear anywhere in FAA's registration system unless it's coded into the serial number somehow.

The FAA fellow said that editing the drone registration requirements and modifying the Web site to match them literally requires an Act of Congress; so for now, changing the serial number on the drone to the RID module's serial number is what they're doing.

In short: I don't know what would happen if the same RID module serial number is applied to an additional drone in FAA's system. It may welcome it with open arms and a sloppy kiss, or it may vomit on it. I just don't know. It will not, however, create a problem on the company's system.

It also is possible to register the RID module separately as a UAS and pay the fee, but that would only make sense in very limited recreational situations where the drone itself is not required to be registered, but the operator wants RID.

I've spoken with several FAA staff about this. I had 4 aircraft registered and have a single device. All staff told me to remove the aircraft and enter only the device serial. When I inquired as to how this affected operations prior to September, I didn't receive a response. Thus aircraft operating legally without the device must still be present in the database, a nifty conflict.

 

[JoeLypowy]

Last week I received my Dronetag Mini after being on back order for several weeks. So far I attached it to the top of my EVO and did all the registrations and so on. Soon as the weather gets better I will taking it out for a test flight.

 

[GeekOnTheWing]

I've spoken with several FAA staff about this. I had 4 aircraft registered and have a single device. All staff told me to remove the aircraft and enter only the device serial. When I inquired as to how this affected operations prior to September, I didn't receive a response. Thus aircraft operating legally without the device must still be present in the database, a nifty conflict.

Joseph Heller lives.

 

[pedals2paddles]

Typical government operation. And I work for the government. Can confirm. Lol

 

[G_G]

Joseph Heller lives.

Catch 22 for the win!

 

[moodman]

So I have a theoretical question...If I am in the wilderness without my own cell connection to a tower somewhere, does RID work? With ADSB on a GA aircraft, the aircraft itself connects to other aircraft without the need for a land-based connection, such as cell towers or the internet.
Just wondering about how the RID theoretically is supposed to work in such cases.

 

[pedals2paddles]

So I have a theoretical question...If I am in the wilderness without my own cell connection to a tower somewhere, does RID work?

There is no connection to the outside world or to any other system to begin with. Nothing is reporting back to a server or to the FAA. The RID device is broadcasting in the blind for anyone with a receiver device in the vicinity to pickup. It doesn't matter if you're in Manhattan or the Sahara desert.

It is not like ADS-B at all.

 

[DroneRat]

I'm curious as I have been following Drone ID articles. I'm sure I missed it someplace, but does each drone you own require it's own or separate ID TAG. Or can you use the Same ID Tag on Different Aircraft?

IF FLOWN RECREATIONALLY THE ID CAN BE TRANSFERABLE. ANY NON-RECREATIONAL WILL REQUIRE INDIVIDUAL RID's.

 

[GeekOnTheWing]

So I have a theoretical question...If I am in the wilderness without my own cell connection to a tower somewhere, does RID work? With ADSB on a GA aircraft, the aircraft itself connects to other aircraft without the need for a land-based connection, such as cell towers or the internet.
Just wondering about how the RID theoretically is supposed to work in such cases.

Yes. Broadcast Remote ID does not require a mobile connection.

What I don't know, specific to the Dronetag, is whether the flight will sync to one's account from the app when they do have a mobile connection. I can test that out at Big Pond when the weather clears up.

 

[moodman]

Yes. Broadcast Remote ID does not require a mobile connection.

What I don't know, specific to the Dronetag, is whether the flight will sync to one's account from the app when they do have a mobile connection. I can test that out at Big Pond when the weather clears up.

Please do that. I am super curious...

 

[Eagle928]

From what I understand, recreational flyers can use the same module on multiple aircraft but 107 flyers have to have a separate module for each drone. Grrrr.

 

[moodman]

From what I understand, recreational flyers can use the same module on multiple aircraft but 107 flyers have to have a separate module for each drone. Grrrr.

That being the case, I wish I was smart enough to do the engineering to make a tag that was able to be programmable through software "on the fly". I would envision the ideal tag to be able to be pinged through bluetooth and then you could choose which bird (maybe from a dropdown menu) you are going to fly on that occasion. Then it would identify itself as that drone until you change it again. Simple concept and I think it would sell like hotcakes!

 

[GeekOnTheWing]

That being the case, I wish I was smart enough to do the engineering to make a tag that was able to be programmable through software "on the fly". I would envision the ideal tag to be able to be pinged through bluetooth and then you could choose which bird (maybe from a dropdown menu) you are going to fly on that occasion. Then it would identify itself as that drone until you change it again. Simple concept and I think it would sell like hotcakes!

Theoretically, it would be simple to code something like that by aliasing pseudo serial numbers to the hardware serial number, and associating each aircraft's information to its pseudo serial number. It would be similar to spoofing the MAC address on a router, for those of us familiar with that sort of thing.

In practice, it could be difficult or impossible to do on a device with limited storage and processing capabilities and an embedded OS.

The first company to pull it off could have a hot seller on their hands, though.

 

[Jan Jiroušek]

So I have a theoretical question...If I am in the wilderness without my own cell connection to a tower somewhere, does RID work? With ADSB on a GA aircraft, the aircraft itself connects to other aircraft without the need for a land-based connection, such as cell towers or the internet.
Just wondering about how the RID theoretically is supposed to work in such cases.

Hi, this is Jan from Dronetag. I am not here to sell or promote, I just want to clarify things. There are 2 types of Remote ID. First is Broadcast Remote ID, for which Bluetooth or Wi-Fi was chosen. During this type of Remote ID there is no limitation due to cell connectivity, these Remote ID broadcasts will work anywhere. Second type of RID is Network Remote ID (which is not a topic in US, however is a topic in EU). During Network Remote ID, the data are broadcasted via mobile networks and if there is no connectivity, no Network Remote ID runs.

 

[Jan Jiroušek]

Yes. Broadcast Remote ID does not require a mobile connection.

What I don't know, specific to the Dronetag, is whether the flight will sync to one's account from the app when they do have a mobile connection. I can test that out at Big Pond when the weather clears up.

Hi, this is Jan from Dronetag. The flight sync is now available only with our device Mini, which has cellular connectivity. The device on your photo is a Dronetag Beacon, capable of Broadcast Remote ID only, so there is no sim card with cellular in Beacon. Due to this, the flight sync from Beacon is not happening yet. However, we plan to introduce this functionality for Beacon soon.

 

[GeekOnTheWing]

Hi, this is Jan from Dronetag. The flight sync is now available only with our device Mini, which has cellular connectivity. The device on your photo is a Dronetag Beacon, capable of Broadcast Remote ID only, so there is no sim card with cellular in Beacon. Due to this, the flight sync from Beacon is not happening yet. However, we plan to introduce this functionality for Beacon soon.

Thanks, Jan. That answers a question I was in the process of posting.

 

[ne0031]

IF FLOWN RECREATIONALLY THE ID CAN BE TRANSFERABLE. ANY NON-RECREATIONAL WILL REQUIRE INDIVIDUAL RID's.

This is not what the FAA told me, nor how the device inventory is designed. Given that there is no database field for a chassis/airframe identifier, there is then no way to tell what RID would match to what airframe.

On a related topic, when the last rep asked me what UAS I was trying to register (Evo 2), they told me I didn't need a RID. I had to gently get them to follow along and understand models and serial numbers, since all mine are v1.