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New EVO II Favorite Feature - Turn off ALL of the Lights

herein2021

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Still not sure where you are getting the 60 minutes or 1 hour. Its really simple, if you are 107 you should remember from the test. For 107, you only get 30 minute before sunrise, or, 30 minutes after sunset in continental US including with anti collision lights. So no, in the continental US, you can not fly as 107 60 minute after sunset (or 60 min before sunrise) without out a waiver as you would be 30 min beyond the 30 min after sunset (or before sunrise) rule. Its pretty straightforward. Happy to take offline and chat if you like.

Because civil twilight is defined as 1hr after sunset...not 30min after sunset. You are right, this is actually in the drone class and on the test. You only get 30min before sunrise or after sunset if you do not have anti-collision lights. You get 1hr (the definition of civil twilight) if you do, its that simple. I honestly have no interest in splitting hairs offline over the definition of civil twilight offline especially since it is spelled out right in every link I've provided.

 

gschulzuio

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Because civil twilight is defined as 1hr after sunset...not 30min after sunset. You are right, this is actually in the drone class and on the test. You only get 30min before sunrise or after sunset if you do not have anti-collision lights. You get 1hr (the definition of civil twilight) if you do, its that simple. I honestly have no interest in splitting hairs offline over the definition of civil twilight offline especially since it is spelled out right in every link I've provided.

No worries, not looking to split hair or make stuff up. If you were 107 you would recall the 30 min before and 30 min after which is in the FAA regulations and tests. Happy to chat, not split hairs off line.
 

herein2021

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No worries, not looking to split hair or make stuff up. If you were 107 you would recall the 30 min before and 30 min after which is in the FAA regulations and tests. Happy to chat, not split hairs off line.
Ok I'll make it even easier for you....here is the FAA's definition of twilight...and recall their website states that you can fly during twilight IF you have anti-collision lights:


And if that is not enough here is ANOTHER link that says the same thing I said. Once again...daylight is defined as 30min before sunrise and after the sunset and needs no anti-collision lights, civil twilight is defined as 1hr before sunrise and 1hr after sunset and needs anti-collision lights but does not need a daylight operations waiver. I know the verbiage is about as clear as mud, but the fact remains that you can fly up to 59min after sunset as long as you have anti-collision lights without a daylight operations waiver:

 
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gschulzuio

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Ok I'll make it even easier for you....here is the FAA's definition of twilight...and recall their website states that you can fly during twilight IF you have anti-collision lights:


And if that is not enough here is ANOTHER link that says the same thing I said. Once again...daylight is defined as 30min before and after the sunset and needs no anti-collision lights, civil twilight is defined as 1hr before sunrise and 1hr after sunset and needs anti-collision lights but does not need a daylight operations waiver. I know the verbiage is about as clear as mud, but the fact remains that you can fly up to 59min after sunset as long as you have anti-collision lights without a daylight operations waiver:

I read that when preparing for my 107.29 daylight waiver a few years ago. However there are specifics for UAS UAV drones. If you are 107 you recall from training & tests "Daylight-only operations, or civil twilight (30 minutes before official sunrise to 30 minutes after official sunset, local time) with appropriate anti-collision lighting" the quote is from https://www.faa.gov/uas/media/Part_107_Summary.pdf. Its really simple, no need to keep searching for answers that fit. Happy to chat to help clarify.
 

KlooGee

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Because civil twilight is defined as 1hr after sunset...not 30min after sunset. You are right, this is actually in the drone class and on the test. You only get 30min before sunrise or after sunset if you do not have anti-collision lights. You get 1hr (the definition of civil twilight) if you do, its that simple. I honestly have no interest in splitting hairs offline over the definition of civil twilight offline especially since it is spelled out right in every link I've provided.


I'm afraid you are referencing and quoting incorrect information. You need to go to the text of the 107 regulations to get the correct definition as defined for the 107 regulations. It very clearly defines "civil twilight" as it relates to flying under 107. You can quote other locations or other sites with whatever their interpretations are, but don't count on their information to keep you out of trouble.

This is directly from the US Electronic Code of Federal Regulations. Refer to 107.29(c)(1)... I've copied it below...


§107.29 Daylight operation.​

(a) No person may operate a small unmanned aircraft system during night.
(b) No person may operate a small unmanned aircraft system during periods of civil twilight unless the small unmanned aircraft has lighted anti-collision lighting visible for at least 3 statute miles. The remote pilot in command may reduce the intensity of the anti-collision lighting if he or she determines that, because of operating conditions, it would be in the interest of safety to do so.
(c) For purposes of paragraph (b) of this section, civil twilight refers to the following:
(1) Except for Alaska, a period of time that begins 30 minutes before official sunrise and ends at official sunrise;
(2) Except for Alaska, a period of time that begins at official sunset and ends 30 minutes after official sunset; and
(3) In Alaska, the period of civil twilight as defined in the Air Almanac.
 

verticalflyer

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Good info and spot on from my understanding. It'll all be a moot point in a few weeks, supposedly, once the FAA provides direct instruction and knowledge on night ops per the recent rulings. Take their online course and have properly setup equipment then fly. Per the rule, the FAA will be providing the course/knowledge assessment directly.

 
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gschulzuio

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I'm afraid you are referencing and quoting incorrect information. You need to go to the text of the 107 regulations to get the correct definition as defined for the 107 regulations. It very clearly defines "civil twilight" as it relates to flying under 107. You can quote other locations or other sites with whatever their interpretations are, but don't count on their information to keep you out of trouble.

This is directly from the US Electronic Code of Federal Regulations. Refer to 107.29(c)(1)... I've copied it below...


§107.29 Daylight operation.​

(a) No person may operate a small unmanned aircraft system during night.
(b) No person may operate a small unmanned aircraft system during periods of civil twilight unless the small unmanned aircraft has lighted anti-collision lighting visible for at least 3 statute miles. The remote pilot in command may reduce the intensity of the anti-collision lighting if he or she determines that, because of operating conditions, it would be in the interest of safety to do so.
(c) For purposes of paragraph (b) of this section, civil twilight refers to the following:
(1) Except for Alaska, a period of time that begins 30 minutes before official sunrise and ends at official sunrise;
(2) Except for Alaska, a period of time that begins at official sunset and ends 30 minutes after official sunset; and
(3) In Alaska, the period of civil twilight as defined in the Air Almanac.

Good info and spot on from my understanding. It'll all be a mute point in a few weeks, supposedly, once the FAA provides direct instruction and knowledge on night ops per the recent rulings. Take their online course and have properly setup equipment then fly. Per the rule, the FAA will be providing the course/knowledge assessment directly.

Yup, class/training becomes available 3/1/21, once you take the training, you can then start flying as of 3/16/21.
 
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DikoB

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As far as turning off the lights on DJI products before I got into the Autels, Black electrical tape took care of that every time starting with the Inspire 1's and early Matrices, because the lights forward would often mess up late sunset shots, only on the edges, but enough to be a nuisance.
 
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herein2021

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@KlooGee @gschulzuio you are both correct and I was mistaken. I looked up the FAA definition of civil twilight years ago and even though I took the 107 test in 2017 and renewed it in 2019 it still did not register for me that the FAA had literally modified their own definition of civil twilight just to make it more restrictive for drones.

I will however stick with what my local FSDO stated which was that the new rules are effective on 1 March....I'm going to try to get it in writing from him as an additional safety measure.
 
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gschulzuio

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@KlooGee @gschulzuio you are both correct and I was mistaken. I looked up the FAA definition of civil twilight years ago and even though I took the 107 test in 2017 and renewed it in 2019 it still did not register for me that the FAA had literally modified their own definition of civil twilight just to make it more restrictive for drones.

I will however stick with what my local FSDO stated which was that the new rules are effective on 1 March....I'm going to try to get it in writing from him as an additional safety measure.
Your FSDO is referring to when the new training portion of the changes becomes available on March 1, 2021. March 16, 2021 is when the new regulations take effect. For example, if you take the new training on March 1, you can then fly at night without a waiver starting March 16. Otoh, if you dont take the new training until say April 1, then you can not fly at night without a waiver until April 1. Also all existing 107.29 waivers including mine expire on May 17, 2021.
 

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gschulzuio

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As far as turning off the lights on DJI products before I got into the Autels, Black electrical tape took care of that every time starting with the Inspire 1's and early Matrices, because the lights forward would often mess up late sunset shots, only on the edges, but enough to be a nuisance.
Dont forget blue painters tape ;)
 

KlooGee

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@KlooGee @gschulzuio you are both correct and I was mistaken. I looked up the FAA definition of civil twilight years ago and even though I took the 107 test in 2017 and renewed it in 2019 it still did not register for me that the FAA had literally modified their own definition of civil twilight just to make it more restrictive for drones.

I will however stick with what my local FSDO stated which was that the new rules are effective on 1 March....I'm going to try to get it in writing from him as an additional safety measure.

As @gschulzuio mentioned, the new training becomes available March 1 that will enable to you to fly at night starting on March 16th or as soon as you've completed the online recency training. Which ever occurs later.

Also, no need to get it in writing from your FSDO, the link I provided previously already has a link in it to the documented upcoming changes in the Code of Federal Regulations. I'll copy it here:



14 CFR--PART 107​

View Printed Federal Register page 86 FR 4382 in PDF format.

Amendment(s) published January 15, 2021, in 86 FR 4382​

Effective Dates: Mar. 16, 2021

14. Amend §107.29 by revising the section heading and paragraphs (a) and (b) and adding paragraph (d) to read as follows:

§107.29 Operation at night.​

(a) Except as provided in paragraph (d) of this section, no person may operate a small unmanned aircraft system at night unless—

(1) The remote pilot in command of the small unmanned aircraft has completed an initial knowledge test or training, as applicable, under §107.65 after March 1, 2021; and

(2) The small unmanned aircraft has lighted anti-collision lighting visible for at least 3 statute miles that has a flash rate sufficient to avoid a collision. The remote pilot in command may reduce the intensity of, but may not extinguish, the anti-collision lighting if he or she determines that, because of operating conditions, it would be in the interest of safety to do so.

(b) No person may operate a small unmanned aircraft system during periods of civil twilight unless the small unmanned aircraft has lighted anti-collision lighting visible for at least 3 statute miles that has a flash rate sufficient to avoid a collision. The remote pilot in command may reduce the intensity of, but may not extinguish, the anti-collision lighting if he or she determines that, because of operating conditions, it would be in the interest of safety to do so.

* * * * *​

(d) After May 17, 2021, no person may operate a small unmanned aircraft system at night in accordance with a certificate of waiver issued prior to March 16, 2021 under §107.200. The certificates of waiver issued prior to March 16, 2021 under §107.200 that authorize deviation from §107.29 terminate on May 17, 2021.
 
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gschulzuio

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The 107.29 text is one of the most clearly worded and unambiguous items of all the regulations.


As @gschulzuio mentioned, the new training becomes available March 1 that will enable to you to fly at night starting on March 16th or as soon as you've completed the online recency training. Which ever occurs later.

Also, no need to get it in writing from your FSDO, the link I provided previously already has a link in it to the documented upcoming changes in the Code of Federal Regulations. I'll copy it here:



14 CFR--PART 107​

View Printed Federal Register page 86 FR 4382 in PDF format.

Amendment(s) published January 15, 2021, in 86 FR 4382​

Effective Dates: Mar. 16, 2021

14. Amend §107.29 by revising the section heading and paragraphs (a) and (b) and adding paragraph (d) to read as follows:

§107.29 Operation at night.​

(a) Except as provided in paragraph (d) of this section, no person may operate a small unmanned aircraft system at night unless—

(1) The remote pilot in command of the small unmanned aircraft has completed an initial knowledge test or training, as applicable, under §107.65 after March 1, 2021; and

(2) The small unmanned aircraft has lighted anti-collision lighting visible for at least 3 statute miles that has a flash rate sufficient to avoid a collision. The remote pilot in command may reduce the intensity of, but may not extinguish, the anti-collision lighting if he or she determines that, because of operating conditions, it would be in the interest of safety to do so.

(b) No person may operate a small unmanned aircraft system during periods of civil twilight unless the small unmanned aircraft has lighted anti-collision lighting visible for at least 3 statute miles that has a flash rate sufficient to avoid a collision. The remote pilot in command may reduce the intensity of, but may not extinguish, the anti-collision lighting if he or she determines that, because of operating conditions, it would be in the interest of safety to do so.

* * * * *​

(d) After May 17, 2021, no person may operate a small unmanned aircraft system at night in accordance with a certificate of waiver issued prior to March 16, 2021 under §107.200. The certificates of waiver issued prior to March 16, 2021 under §107.200 that authorize deviation from §107.29 terminate on May 17, 2021.
Good info. Note one of the changes is that the RPIC may reduce the anti-collision light intensity if doing so benefits safety, however they can not be turned off. For example if flying near a road, so as to not be a safety distraction to vehicle drivers, you could dim the lights, however not turn them off. Otoh turning anti-collision lights off to be in stealth mode would not be compliant. A nice enhancement for Autel would be to add a dim mode to the light on the bottom of the Evo II in addition to the on, off, 1 sec or 2 sec modes currently supported. Btw, fwiw, imho one of the nice features of the E2P for when flying indoors (besides the prop guards) particular very large spaces is having the bottom light that can be turned on and set to 2 sec flash. Would be even nicer if Explorer remembered your last setting for the light.
 

KlooGee

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Good info. Note one of the changes is that the RPIC may reduce the anti-collision light intensity if doing so benefits safety, however they can not be turned off. For example if flying near a road, so as to not be a safety distraction to vehicle drivers, you could dim the lights, however not turn them off. Otoh turning anti-collision lights off to be in stealth mode would not be compliant. A nice enhancement for Autel would be to add a dim mode to the light on the bottom of the Evo II in addition to the on, off, 1 sec or 2 sec modes currently supported. Btw, fwiw, imho one of the nice features of the E2P for when flying indoors (besides the prop guards) particular very large spaces is having the bottom light that can be turned on and set to 2 sec flash. Would be even nicer if Explorer remembered your last setting for the light.
Yes, having the flashing downward LED is nice and something I would like to see DJI integrate into their downward LED as well!
 

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