Confronted By Three Charlotte-Mecklenburg Police Last Night

[tvwxman]

I have spent the past few evenings flying my E2P around Uptown Charlotte trying to get some nice dusk shots with sunsets and city lights coming on before I need to ground it with the Class B restrictions forcing me down 30 minutes after sunset.

Upon landing last evening two police officers circled in on their cycles, and a third rolled into the park in his SUV. My drone touched down just as the police arrived. Not surprisingly the questions started immediately the first of which was are you authorized to fly here? Fortunately I had checked all the boxes, not the least of which was getting laanc authorization. I showed him my text message from the FAA approving my flight. He then asked if I was aware where I couldn't fly and I told him absolutely as I had to draw out my perimeter on the Kitty Hawk app in order to get approved. I pointed out that I couldn't fly "over there" for instance because of the proximity to the hospitals. Almost immediately he said, "correct". I was a little surprised at his knowledge of the flight restriction nuances and then he told me he was a Mavic Air 2 owner and that explained it.

At that point he looked at me and said, "Congratulations, you are the first person we have confronted flying a drone around here that has actually followed all the rules!" He then pointed out that they have encountered several corporate drone pilots for the banks here, along with one of our major league sports teams (I am purposely not naming them) that had not checked any of the boxes and were totally flying illegally.

They were laughing saying I wasn't hard to track with my bottom strobe light flashing every one second. I don't think that counts as an anti-collision light, but it was another sign to them I was trying to use all the tools I had to be safe and conspicuous.

So in sum, it was a bittersweet encounter. The officers were all fantastic - truly courteous and professional. I was proud to get high marks from them, but a little sadden to hear other drone pilots are flaunting the rules and not helping to maintain a high standard for our hobby (or vocation). I'm still learning myself as there seems to be a myriad of rules and opinions on the rules, so I know I'm not perfect by any means.

Here is a sample clip from my trips these past few days! Wait for the sun! I hope you are able to watch it in 4K. I can't get over the quality of the H.265 10-Bit video. This is the result after VERY little color grading in Premiere Pro.

 

[advexure]

I have spent the past few evenings flying my E2P around Uptown Charlotte trying to get some nice dusk shots with sunsets and city lights coming on before I need to ground it with the Class B restrictions forcing me down 30 minutes after sunset.

Upon landing last evening two police officers circled in on their cycles, and a third rolled into the park in his SUV. My drone touched down just as the police arrived. Not surprisingly the questions started immediately the first of which was are you authorized to fly here? Fortunately I had checked all the boxes, not the least of which was getting laanc authorization. I showed him my text message from the FAA approving my flight. He then asked if I was aware where I couldn't fly and I told him absolutely as I had to draw out my perimeter on the Kitty Hawk app in order to get approved. I pointed out that I couldn't fly "over there" for instance because of the proximity to the hospitals. Almost immediately he said, "correct". I was a little surprised at his knowledge of the flight restriction nuances and then he told me he was a Mavic Air 2 owner and that explained it.

At that point he looked at me and said, "Congratulations, you are the first person we have confronted flying a drone around here that has actually followed all the rules!" He then pointed out that they have encountered several corporate drone pilots for the banks here, along with one of our major league sports teams (I am purposely not naming them) that had not checked any of the boxes and were totally flying illegally.

They were laughing saying I wasn't hard to track with my bottom strobe light flashing every one second. I don't think that counts as an anti-collision light, but it was another sign to them I was trying to use all the tools I had to be safe and conspicuous.

So in sum, it was a bittersweet encounter. The officers were all fantastic - truly courteous and professional. I was proud to get high marks from them, but a little sadden to hear other drone pilots are flaunting the rules and not helping to maintain a high standard for our hobby (or vocation). I'm still learning myself as there seems to be a myriad of rules and opinions on the rules, so I know I'm not perfect by any means.

Here is a sample clip from my trips these past few days! Wait for the sun! I hope you are able to watch it in 4K. I can't get over the quality of the H.265 10-Bit video. This is the result after VERY little color grading in Premiere Pro.

Nice job knowing your stuff. ? Glad to hear it was a positive encounter and all parties involved knew the rules/regulations and facts regarding the operation of UAS in your airspace. Safe flying! @tvwxman

 

[9andy]

I have spent the past few evenings flying my E2P around Uptown Charlotte trying to get some nice dusk shots with sunsets and city lights coming on before I need to ground it with the Class B restrictions forcing me down 30 minutes after sunset.

Upon landing last evening two police officers circled in on their cycles, and a third rolled into the park in his SUV. My drone touched down just as the police arrived. Not surprisingly the questions started immediately the first of which was are you authorized to fly here? Fortunately I had checked all the boxes, not the least of which was getting laanc authorization. I showed him my text message from the FAA approving my flight. He then asked if I was aware where I couldn't fly and I told him absolutely as I had to draw out my perimeter on the Kitty Hawk app in order to get approved. I pointed out that I couldn't fly "over there" for instance because of the proximity to the hospitals. Almost immediately he said, "correct". I was a little surprised at his knowledge of the flight restriction nuances and then he told me he was a Mavic Air 2 owner and that explained it.

At that point he looked at me and said, "Congratulations, you are the first person we have confronted flying a drone around here that has actually followed all the rules!" He then pointed out that they have encountered several corporate drone pilots for the banks here, along with one of our major league sports teams (I am purposely not naming them) that had not checked any of the boxes and were totally flying illegally.

They were laughing saying I wasn't hard to track with my bottom strobe light flashing every one second. I don't think that counts as an anti-collision light, but it was another sign to them I was trying to use all the tools I had to be safe and conspicuous.

So in sum, it was a bittersweet encounter. The officers were all fantastic - truly courteous and professional. I was proud to get high marks from them, but a little sadden to hear other drone pilots are flaunting the rules and not helping to maintain a high standard for our hobby (or vocation). I'm still learning myself as there seems to be a myriad of rules and opinions on the rules, so I know I'm not perfect by any means.

Here is a sample clip from my trips these past few days! Wait for the sun! I hope you are able to watch it in 4K. I can't get over the quality of the H.265 10-Bit video. This is the result after VERY little color grading in Premiere Pro.

Thanks for head up.
I just order e2p and in learning all I can about fly drone.
Now I know police officer can enforce FAA rules too.
Thanks again.
Andy

 

[kenautelevo2pro]

Thanks for head up.
I just order e2p and in learning all I can about fly drone.
Now I know police officer can enforce FAA rules too.
Thanks again.
Andy

they cannot. they just think they can. and only if you let them.

the police around here see me flying the drone and they just keep driving by. I live in a free state.

eta: I understand there are some local and state laws erected in certain places; understood.

 

[Jagerbomb52]

Understanding Your Authority: Handling Sightings and Reports

www.faa.gov

There is no such thing as a license. Remote Pilot Certificate isn't a license (Part 107). But yes, you do need to show your RP (Part 107) Certificate upon request (your registration number only for limited recreational flyer the new term for hobbyists)). The registration number must be marked externally on the aircraft.

 

[kenautelevo2pro]

if you break a state law or violate a local/county ordnance, you will need to be prepared to answer to the demands of a peace officer. this would include if you are suspected of breaking a law or about to break a law as well.

 

[9andy]

View attachment 9361

Understanding Your Authority: Handling Sightings and Reports

www.faa.gov

There is no such thing as a license. Remote Pilot Certificate isn't a license (Part 107). But yes, you do need to show your RP (Part 107) Certificate upon request (your registration number only for limited recreational flyer the new term for hobbyists)). The registration number must be marked externally on the aircraft.

Very good info. Thank you.
Andy

 

[xval]

if you break a state law or violate a local/county ordnance, you will need to be prepared to answer to the demands of a peace officer. this would include if you are suspected of breaking a law or about to break a law as well.

Not sure local laws can control the national airspace. NY has something prohibiting launching the drones, and even that I'm not sure works or is legal.

 

[kenautelevo2pro]

Not sure local laws can control the national airspace. NY has something prohibiting launching the drones, and even that I'm not sure works or is legal.

"It is illegal to launch or recover a UAS from either private or state property without the consent of the property's owner (N.C. G.S. 15A-300.2). Local and federal property have their own laws and regulations governing the launch and recovery of UAS."

 

[9andy]

I thought EVO2 will return home before point of no return, so I don’t need to recover it from someone’s property. Am I right?. If not I have to keep my eye on battery.

 

[xval]

I thought EVO2 will return home before point of no return, so I don’t need to recover it from someone’s property. Am I right?. If not I have to keep my eye on battery.

May be , by design yes, but... And yes, you have to keep your eye on battery, take into account wind strength and direction at different altitudes. My rule for safety is simple: plan landing with 5 min left. More complicated rules are:
. prefer downwind launching position if possible. then return home is easier
. if impossible take it into account and reserve more battery for return.
. if too much left for landing I can fly around, record myself, just practice
. if there is more than one target start with most distant. easier to get home from close target if something goes wrong
. plan ahead

 

[Jagerbomb52]

Simple rule:
VLOS and you don't have to worry about it not coming home and landing where you can't get to it.

 

[Stillers]

That does sound like a rare positive interaction with police. Except that the entire thing was an egregious violation of your 1st and 4th Amendment rights and would be a slam dunk in a court room.

Flying a drone is not illegal. Even tho there are restrictions, rules, and regulations that must be followed, the act of simply flying your drone does not constitute probable cause for police to perform a regulatory oversight investigation.. Im also betting they almost immediately asked for identification, too. Sending 3 officers like that is a cliche intimidation tactic to set a subject back on their heels and to increase the likelihood that a subject will comply to authorities they don't have. In every state, a police officer has no authority to order a citizen to identify themselves if they cannot clearly articulate a crime the individual either has committed, is committing, or believes you intend to commit. Aerial photography has repeatedly been upheld as a First Amendment activity. And despite the FAA rules, the act of flying your drone in public is not sufficient probable cause for the officers to believe you were committing any crimes. They went well beyond the limits of their authority under the law to approach you, especially in the manner they did which was intentionally executed to mislead the fact that the interaction was consentual in nature and give you the sense that you were being detained and obligated to cooperate, and their orders for you to present proof of compliance and knowledge of the law were unlawful and a violation of your rights. You have very solid ground and reason to file a complaint with the department in this matter.

 

[tvwxman]

Thanks for your thoughts on the matter! Lots of significant Insight on your part and really appreciate you contributing! Per your question that you raised, they did not ask for my identification but then again they knew who I was already because I am the local television meteorologist on the CBS affiliate in Charlotte. So I don't know if they might have had I been someone they did not already recognize.

One thing I did not mention in my original post was their response to when I asked them what the consequences would have been had they determined I had not been following FAA protocols and regulations, his response was basically nothing. They would take my name and FAA registration number and pass it along to the FAA but beyond that the officer told me he would simply tell me to have a nice night.

 

[Stillers]

I'm very shocked they didn't ID you. But it is very likely that being a local celebrity played a part there. It shows that the officer at least has some ethics about him in that he did not intend to act on any evidence of an infraction. But, it should be pointed out that even if he had discovered a violation, he had no authority to relay any information to the FAA about it because he had never had the authority to obtain the proof of that violation. Had he reported any violation it most certainly would have generated a record on you with the FAA and could have came back to haunt you at a later date.This is why l adamantly urge everyone to stand and fight for every inch of their rights in these situations. Even when it's as innocuous and seemingly harmless as this one. Had a record been created, it likely could have hindered future requests for flight approval or license applications and impeded your right to fly because the police overstepped their authority. I fully support the police. And that's why I regularly challenge them and encourage others to. Because many of them are themselves unclear about what exactly they can and can't do. Educating them through these instances will help them become a better police office and hopefully to decrease the chance that a future interaction they have turns toxic and becomes national news.

Likewise I also encourage people to at a minimum research the basic rights they have regarding police interactions and to stand up for them. But, make sure that you clearly understand the limits and particulars of those rights. Thinking you know them when you don't could result in you making a heinous mistake that does result in criminal charges. If a situation ever turns into one they you don't confidently understand. Compliance regardless of obligation is the safest route.

 

[Stillers]

Not sure local laws can control the national airspace. NY has something prohibiting launching the drones, and even that I'm not sure works or is legal.

Local municipalities have no authority to regulate the flight of a drone. However, they do have the authority to regulate the landing of a drone and the use of a drone remote control unit. There's a city out around LA., I'll have to look up the name of it again, but through clever use of undefined activities under part 107 they've been able to create a word soup that made it nearly impossible to legally land a drone or use the RC within city limits

 

[kenautelevo2pro]

Local municipalities have no authority to regulate the flight of a drone. However, they do have the authority to regulate the landing of a drone and the use of a drone remote control unit. There's a city out around LA., I'll have to look up the name of it again, but through clever use of undefined activities under part 107 they've been able to create a word soup that made it nearly impossible to legally land a drone or use the RC within city limits

yeah that city is called Prairie Village, KS

https://www.kansascity.com/news/politics-government/article234711952.html

 

[Stillers]

yeah that city is called Prairie Village, KS

https://www.kansascity.com/news/politics-government/article234711952.html

I live in the KC Metro area and was unaware of this. Well, I know where I'll be doing my next round of 1A audits at.

 

[kenautelevo2pro]

I live in the KC Metro area and was unaware of this. Well, I know where I'll be doing my next round of 1A audits at.

sure, I saw the location in your profile. you may want to do an open records request and get the exact details of the city ordinance since it might have been modified or already repealed because it absolutely makes no sense. or else the writer is not very smart; what kind of nonsense is this (from the article):

"...But the Federal Aviation Administration regulates commercial drone flight, so the ordinance would apply only to people using drones for recreational use."

good luck with your audit, keep in mind kansas (unlike missouri) is one of the stop-and-id states where law enforcement officers do not need probable cause but only reasonable suspicion to detain you....a much lower standard. pretty much just seeing you holding a drone is enough to seize you and the drone and "investigate" while they think about getting your ID and a warrant for your flight logs/sd card. pretty much police believe if they get a call, that's ras. perhaps they do the educate thing for ordinary citizens but not sure how they would respond to an auditor or someone who stands up for their rights. I guess you would need to be arrested if you plan to challenge and overturn the law; maybe have your lawyer on speed dial. pv is a small city and there are plenty of other places in the metro area to fly I'm sure but like big cities with dozens of tiny suburbs, you're going to get a lot of laws being passed and there's no way to know them all.

I only bring this up since I read your previous post on the topic and I like the way you think. you seem to know your rights and that's a good thing. too many people believe you give up your rights when you get a permit or permission from the government. ultimately if local law enforcement takes on the role of enforcing "drone laws" can you imagine what that would mean for the cause? it's 6pm and you see a drone without a strobe light, a cop could easily claim you're illegally flying after dark. or if they see a mavic mini flying at night with a strobe light, they have good reason to check to see if it bears a registration sticker (if heavy) on the "outside" of the drone. and we haven't even started talking about remote ID.

 

[Stillers]

I'm very curious to see how they've worded this as well because the FAA has flat out made it clear, to the point of using its weight of government against townships attempting to regulate the air that that they have zero authority to. That is the FAAs jurisdiction. And they don't want other hands in the pie. And as for the FAA regulations in place, it's still unclear whether or not local authorities can enforce the through any action other than filing a report with the FAA. Something else that struck me as weird in the wording is that the laws were set in place to protect privacy. It's a very common misconception amongst this country's citizens, but legally, we have no right to privacy in this country. There is not one law or amendment that affords us any sort of protected privacy. We're the only western nation that doesn't have privacy laws. I reckon Siilicon Valley keeps legislating authorities from Pacific to Atlantic very well greased to keep it that way. In any public space this is true to the extent that so long as someone doesn't threaten or physically touch you, they can do almost anything. Even on private property it's very thin. If the police arrest a man for looking in a young girl's window, he doesn't get arrested for a sex crime or anything at all related to privacy. They can only run him in on trespassing. So, in effect, courts are telling you that. There is no legal precedent for stopping a man from watching a young girl change clothes in her own bedroom without consent, he just can't do it on someone else's property. So if this law is based in any way about individual privacy, then I'm afraid I've got some bad news for them.

Yes, I've had my fair share of run ins with Kansas Law before. Johnson County is the richest part of the city, cops down there are programmed that their job is to serve and protect the rich. Not us. They are also not used to receiving any measurable resistance to their questions. So it's very easy to get them wound up and force them to make mistakes. But I'm willing to bet they'll be wrong from jump street. If they think that holding a RC is going to withstand scrutiny, even if their regulations are legal, they are wrong. I'm curious to see if they will even adhere to pilot safety protections because most dont.

I'll definitely do my research going in. It's usually a solid 2 months of legal beagle bookwork preparing for an audit. And I'm no stranger to handcuffs either. But, my record inside a court room is a long list of butt hurt prosecutors. And for the hobby alone, I certainly hope this audit winds up in front of a federal judge. Police and municipalities are getting away with this crap because there's virtually no case law on the matter of drones and constitutional rights. So it's literally the wild west. I keep dreaming that one of these days I'll realize my dream of getting my name on a Keystone case on the issue in front of the Supreme Court. Maybe someday.

But I do appreciate your input and I'll be sure to follow up.

And on a side note, if Prarie Village gets their panties in a wad about someone holding an RC, they're gonna shot themselves when I set up a table and start unpacking a command station and 20' antenna array. Lol.